September 30, 2020

Design Virtual Immersive Experiences: Webinar Recap

Emma Schnee

Nonprofit Consultant at MURAL // Innovating at the intersection of design and social impact.

During the month of September, MURAL's weekly Backstage Pass webinars are focused on working with social impact imagination workers. Each week, a new nonprofit or educator joins the MURAL team to engage in a live, collaborative coaching session to address a challenge they've been facing.

Bringing people together is a core part of learning. Forums, galleries, and innovation spaces are fundamental to sharing best practices. When the classroom is completely online, how do you make these experiences possible? For the final September Backstage Pass: Impact Edition Rebecca Komarek, assistant director and adjunct faculty instructor at CU Boulder, joined MURAL’s Hailey Temple and Mark Tippin to imagine how to run a physical prototyping workshop using digital tools.

Rebecca is part of Idea Forge, a cross-disciplinary prototyping space at CU Boulder. In the past, students came to the space to participate in sessions, prototype their ideas, and engage in hands-on collaboration. Now, Rebecca and her team are recreating the prototyping space as well as their programs virtually.

Below, find a walkthrough of last Friday’s Backstage Pass session — or watch the replay to see it in action.

What is virtual Idea Forge?

We started by learning about what the virtual Idea Forge space looks like now. Rebecca created a “choose your own adventure” tour of the space that new participants engage in asynchronously before their session.

Get inspired by her creative layout and intentional path creation in MURAL.

🚀 PRO TIP: Rebecca links to spaces on the mural and steps in the outline to increase ease of use.

The virtual prototype setup

Audience members were brought on to consult on the challenge. We started by gaining an understanding of the students’ situation. Students can pick up physical prototyping materials from the Idea Forge space to take home with them. They then participate in a short session where they have the opportunity to reimagine what virtual prototyping can be.

In these short sessions, the Idea Forge team hopes to:

  • Empower students to recognize that prototypes don’t have to be perfect — in fact, prototypes should not be perfect
  • Teach an iterative mindset
  • Encourage intentional prototyping guided by specific questions

🚀 PRO TIP: Mark took contextual notes by typing on sticky notes and hitting tab on the keyboard to quickly add a new sticky.

Brainstorming to problem solve

During Friday’s Backstage Pass session, the audience participants, Mark, and Hailey had time to prototype their own ideas of how the virtual sessions could go.

Here are some takeaways from their brainstorm.

  • Break out students into teams where they can brainstorm in MURAL while prototyping with their physical materials they picked up
  • Assign roles to team members based on their strengths
  • Try to blend the reality of physical and virtual. A suggested flow: physical prototype, virtual sharing/critiquing, blended iteration
  • Time box the participants to ensure quick, imperfect preliminary prototypes

🚀 PRO TIP: Hailey demonstrated Private Mode as a new facilitation superpower.

The MURAL touch

It wouldn’t be a MURAL session if it wasn’t both fun and informative. So how did it all come together? In the full replay you will also catch:

  • A warmup activity where panelists drew a unique story about themselves
  • Participants thinking about how Elon Musk might approach this challenge

Replay the webinar 📹

Access the presentation mural 👀

Additional resources to explore 🔭

🙌 Visit the MURAL for Nonprofits webpage to see if your organization qualifies for a free workspace

🕒 For quick tips on remote work check out our MURAL Minute YouTube Series

💻 Learn more about Idea Forge and CU Boulder

Upcoming events 🧠

Want to be our next webinar guest? Contact emmas@mural.co.

Backstage Pass: Impact Edition will continue on the last Friday of every month!

Visual collaboration experts coach nonprofits and educators making change.

Next up October 30

TRANSCRIPT

Mark Tippin: [00:00:00] Welcome everyone to Backstage Pass. my name is Mark Tippin. I'm the head of learning experience at MURAL. my cohost is Haley Temple. and, for the next 60 minutes, we're going to take you behind the scenes of a teamwork session. And we have a very special guest today joining us from Colorado. we encourage you to use the chat like you're starting to do, to build community, share links, get to know each other. do you use the QA since we're using webinar, we actually have a dedicated QA channel that helps us keep track of questions. If we can't get to them right away, then we can get to them, at moments where there are natural breaks are at the end. So we don't want to lose, track of your questions. Our goal is to help you gain confidence in using MURAL and a bunch of different use cases.

With MURAL Backstage Pass, we're just broadcasting the work and our discussions as it happens. And we hope that this, that this will inspire you to use your facilitation superpowers in new ways with your teams. Haley and I might from time to time, make note of certain features or best practices and kind of highlight things as they happen. and some additional learning goodness, along the way. We always learn from these sessions. And, and we, we know you're, you look forward to them as well. Haley, so what, what are we going to do today?

Haley Temple: [00:01:19] Yeah, so I'm delighted to have, this is the final Friday of the month of our impact edition here at Backstage Pass. But good news is we are going to have our impact edition every Friday, the last Friday of every month. So we'll have more education and nonprofit opportunities, on Backstage Pass. We're super happy about that. So today to round us off for the month of September is Rebecca Comark, Comerick yes there we go.

Mark Tippin: [00:01:50] You're good.

]Haley Temple: [00:01:51] Okay. Who, who is I, who obviously does a ton of awesome work at University of Colorado Boulder. And she's been using MURAL [00:02:00] for the past couple months with changes in the ways that schools and universities are teaching to design these awesome immersive experiences for students. Plus she actually has a couple of other challenges that she wants to collaborate with those of you in the community today and talk more about. So, today we are going to focus on the challenge that students and I imagine many of you at work, your employees need a way to show and share work, to get inspiration and to learn from one another.

So today we want to think about ways to create immersive experiences and a little bit later, well you're going to have something focused on prototyping and which is a specific challenge to Rebecca's class. So usually in Backstage Pass, we bring our panelists in and we will act as consultants in a session helping Rebecca think about this challenge. So if you're interested later on in this session to help work with Rebecca, talk about ways that she could think about physical prototyping type in all caps. Yes. In the chat. And later on in this session, we will bring you in to work with us.

Mark Tippin: [00:03:16] Boom, boom, got some people saying, yes, all right.

Haley Temple: [00:03:18] All right. So we'll bring you in later. no worries. And what I want to do before we kick off is a quick warmup. So Mark, let me invite you in here to do this warm up with us. I love doing warmups together.

Mark Tippin: [00:03:32] That's good [crosstalk 00:03:47].

]Haley Temple: [00:03:35] In the Zoom chat for the, I just sent it to you.

Mark Tippin: [00:03:39] Got it correctly. Cool. I'll be right there.

Haley Temple: [00:03:41] All right. And for those of you who are in the audience, if you want to follow along as visitor, I'm also gonna share that link so you can watch and go along too. All right. So here's our warmup. What we're going to do is tell a [00:04:00] unique story about yourself with a drawing. So today let me update this here. Since Jeff is, Jeff is on another call right now.

Mark Tippin: [00:04:10] You can, you can call me Jeff.

Haley Temple: [00:04:11] All right, I'll call you Jeff for today.

Mark Tippin: [00:04:12] I've been called much worse than Jeff. [laughs]

Haley Temple: [00:04:16] So what we're going to do is tell unique fact about yourself with a drawing. And, for those of you who don't know how to draw in MURAL, it's this little pencil tool right here and you just click it and then you can start sketching whatever you like. So Rebecca, Mark, and I are going to make a unique fact about ourselves. And I'm going to give us a pretty short amount of time to do it. I'll give us hmm 45 seconds.

Mark Tippin: [00:04:48] Whoa! Okay.

Haley Temple: [00:04:49] Ready? And go. Oh, dang it. I don't even know my unique fact.

Mark Tippin: [00:05:07] Oh, I gotta get a better mouse pad.

Haley Temple: [00:05:37] Sketching with a mouse is really hard. [laughs] I swear. It looks, I'm a better sketcher [crosstalk 00:05:54].

Mark Tippin: [00:05:42] I know like this is like, after I've been hit on the head really hard. This is me trying to draw.

Haley Temple: [00:05:47] That's kind of [crosstalk 00:06:00]. Okay. Maybe it's just, I know that fact, but it's really cool. All right. [laughs] So if I was pretty five seconds really fast, Rebecca, you actually made something like really cool.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:05:56] I also, I started a little early.

Haley Temple: [00:05:58] You did? You're like, okay, I need to do this, let's go.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:05:59] Yeah, you were talking. I [00:06:00] was like, I'm doing this.

Haley Temple: [00:06:02] [laughs] I love it. All right, Rebecca, tell us, what is your fun fact or a unique story?

Rebecca Komarek: [00:06:08] I'll try to tell this quickly. I, worked as a structural forensic engineer, my first job and that's me on the bridge there. I was like wiring stuff up. We were monitoring this bridge. they were doing construction on it. We want to make sure it wouldn't fall down with all the extra construction load. And I was working, bent over and I looked up and a train was coming and the train engineer blew the horn because they saw me on the track and I like popped my head up. And I was like, whoa! And so I had like, you had like a spot that we would go and [inaudible 00:06:53]. So I dove through this little spot it had like a harness on.

Haley Temple: [00:06:43] Oh my gosh.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:06:43] And I think that we had a stern conversation with the train, company. And then we put people on either end of the bridge with blow horns to let us know when trains were approaching.

Haley Temple: [00:06:53] Oh my gosh.

Mark Tippin: [00:06:54] Whoa!

Haley Temple: [00:06:54] That's kind of like an Epic story though.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:06:57] Right [inaudible 00:07:14].

Haley Temple: [00:06:58] Also an Epic job. Like you're on a bridge with trains coming. I like, they weren't like, okay, we're gonna stop the trains coming. They were like, you got to watch out now just in case.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:07:06] Yeah, yeah.

Haley Temple: [00:07:08] Cool. Thanks for sharing.

Mark Tippin: [00:07:09] [crosstalk 00:07:26].

Haley Temple: [00:07:10] All right, Jeff/Mark, what is your name?

Mark Tippin: [00:07:16] Yeah. This is my go to, this is my go to, so a lot of people don't realize that I used to be cool. And so back back in the day in the 80s and 90s, I had a 14 inch Mohawk and played in a band. We shared the stage and with, with some of the big punk bands from the day, never played with Green Day or Rancid, but we played alternate weekends up in Berkeley. And so, I have, I have photo reference to, to get street cred with my son about how I used to be. Cool. Oh, there you go.

Haley Temple: [00:07:46] There he is.

Mark Tippin: [00:07:46] [laughs] For real, the big, the baby faced punk, still sitting there with my tongue out, trying to figure out how to play the chords. Yeah. [laughs]

Haley Temple: [00:07:56] Love it. Yeah. All right. Thank you, Mark. And then mine. [00:08:00] Mine. I couldn't think of one. So I just sketch something really quick. I, when I set alarm clocks, I only can set it to odd numbers, but it can't be a number three. I don't know why, but there's something very strange.

Mark Tippin: [00:08:14] That makes so much sense now. [laughs]

Haley Temple: [00:08:18] Awesome. Well, this is really cool. And Rebecca, I think this is very appropriate also for the work you're doing at, with your students and at the university. So I'd love to hand it over to you actually to tell us a little bit about how you are using MURAL kind of a show and tell session. How are you using MURAL with your students? Given that I imagine the last couple of months you haven't been able to be in the classroom right? With your students?

Rebecca Komarek: [00:08:47] Right? yeah, so it's definitely, been a little bit of an adventure. we we've been calling it an educational experiment, let me they get to the right page here.  

Haley Temple: [00:09:00] And are students now back in class? Or is it, this is still a case where you can't be in the classroom?

Rebecca Komarek: [00:09:06] well, things keep evolving. So, when the semester started in August at the University of Colorado, we are in more or less a hybrid model where some classes were online, some classes were considered remote where they're, everything's going on at the same time. But, but you're on Zoom generally for class. And there are classes that are hybrid or maybe the labs are in person, but the lecture was remote or maybe a 30 person class, 15 people would show up in the classroom. And 15 people would be virtually in the [inaudible 00:10:00]. You know, they do that on Tuesday, on Thursday, they flip. So, more or less hybrid model. but as of this week I guess starting on Wednesday, we went 100% remote. and that is because cases were spiking among students. And actually the city of Boulder, just yesterday Institute of public health order that there's no gathering allowed for people between the ages of 18 and 22.

So very specifically...

Haley Temple: [00:09:59] [00:10:00] Convenient. [laughs]

Rebecca Komarek: [00:10:01] the college students. they're not trying to hide that at all. so this is the facility that I work in. the idea forward. So we are the campus design and prototyping facility. And so, normally we have a, a, a huge space. We have events like you see here in this picture and we have, fabrication shops. Like you can call us a Maker space or kind of a dispersed Maker space in that we have a dedicated machine shop. We have, with welding, we have a dedicated electronics area, 3D printing, laser cutting as well as a wood shop. And they're all separate. And we have different engineers who run each space. typically students are in this shops building their projects themselves. And we support classes and we support student groups, as well as entrepreneurial or just student driven projects.

But the way that we're doing it this semester is to try and keep our people safe as well as to keep students safe and to keep consistency throughout the semester. Our engineers are actually building projects for the students. So the students are submitting their drawings, they're submitting their models and our people are building them and then leaving them for students to pick up because most of the students are adjacent to campus they're on campus or they're in the area, even if we have some kind of a remote learning situation going on. So for students to actually get access to our computer systems, to actually use the 3D printers or to use the equipment, they generally take an access tour. Where, we walked them around or usually our students staff walk them around. They, you know, give them the basic info on all of our given spaces, give them an intro to all of our individual people.

And, and then they sign our user agreement, which means, you know, pretty much you'll treat our stuff with respect, et cetera, et cetera. And it gives us the right to, you know, ban people from the space if we need to, which unfortunately we have had to do on very rare occasions. so that's kind of what we normally do. we were unable to do that this semester, as you may imagine with the gathering, et cetera. and so I devised a virtual tour, so this is how students access [00:12:00] it. I'm going to walk you through it here. So using MURAl, and so this is, you know, build your own adventure enter as a visitor. It's kind of a build your own adventure in MURAl. and students can do this on their own. So as we talk in, in college terms, we talk about asynchronous learning or synchronous learning.

So being there at the same time or there, at separate times, so students can do this on their own. so this was our main open space. try, I tried to put in a little bit of introductory, wording here, like where to start. again, generally when students take our tour, they sign our user agreement. So we have an online user agreement that students can sign on, But there's a little concern that students wouldn't actually go through the entire tour. so I've put a little scavenger hunt in. so I'll show you that when we get there, so students can start here and it takes them to, our initial, landing space here. so again, trying to get them acclimated to this, you know, presuming people haven't used MURAL before, so start here so they can click here and they can learn about the comments.

So this area, this photo we call the comments. it's like our big gathering space. And so people can read about the space. you know, people drop in for, prototyping. They drop in for, just project work. people stop here and study there's tools, easily accessible. We have storage for projects. and then in red I have all of the, specific COVID that, you know, fall semester, 2020 specific things are listed in red. So you can learn about this space and then all of these blue boxes take you back to kind of this navigation page

Haley Temple: [00:13:36] And Rebecca though you're in, you're in view only mode, but how did you just for the, for our community here, how did you do those go to buttons or like, 'cause [crosstalk 00:14:34].

Rebecca Komarek: [00:13:47] Yeah, so let me take a little step back here. So I have all these various photos that we have of our spaces and, each one is in like a freeform area.

Haley Temple: [00:13:59] Mm-hmm [00:14:00] [affirmative].

Rebecca Komarek: [00:14:00] so, you know, we can move it all at the same time. And so I linked from each area to each area, and I don't know if, you know, if you right click on an area, you can give it your link to this area is one of the options.

Haley Temple: [00:14:11] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

Rebecca Komarek: [00:14:11] You might be able to explain it better than me, but you [crosstalk 00:15:03].

Haley Temple: [00:14:15] You're doing great. You're you're great. Yeah.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:14:16] But you can look to this area. and then when you put in a text box, when a text box pops up, when you have a text box, the little, the little, what formatting or editing bar comes up. And so there's, you can link, you know, there's a little link symbol there. So you could like kind of link from area to area. I feel like I can show you better, but I'm not in a life. Like I'm a visitor here.

Haley Temple: [00:14:38] I know we can do it when we get back in the, in the main mirror. No worries.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:14:41] Okay. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah.

Haley Temple: [00:14:43] So you described it really well.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:14:44] [crosstalk 00:15:37] each area has its own little URL and you can link to it through these little buttons.

Mark Tippin: [00:14:46] Oh, you can also [crosstalk 00:15:46] I was going to mention, you could also link to completely different MURALs using the same metaphor. and also comments. I think if you dropped in a comment, the link that gets sent to folks can send them right. Specifically into the MURAL and the location where you want, but I love how you're using it here. It is. I get the sense of like, you could just explore the space. You've created space, recreated this space virtually.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:15:14] Yeah. And that was the goal. So, you know, we created the space, so also created, little panels for each of our people. So this is my boss. and so when I, and there's a little video here of her getting smashed in the face with a pie. for Pie Day, which we did one day or, you know, at 3:14. and so the little, scavenger hunt, this is the yak. So the students who do is they have to find all these little icons and, write them down and they take the first letter of each icon to spell out a secret word. And that secret word is prototype. And they fill that in to the user agreement. You know, [crosstalk 00:16:48] at least scroll around enough and I try to put these little icons in the most important things that we need to know. so I mean, ultimately the goal is that they use these [00:16:00] buttons to go from place to place, which, mimics walking through our actual facility. In theory, they could scroll out and scroll in and look at each one, you know, and not do it in any order if they so chose, but I'm just choosing not to worry about that.

Haley Temple: [00:16:16] [laughs] now I love the scavenger hunt.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:16:19] Yeah. So then we're also just, you know, showing our spaces. so we have this predotyping cabinet, so low level prototyping, so it has cardboard, Legos, tape, things like that in it. and then I put little clues. So I had my student employees do this, tour and they told me all of the things that were challenging. And they were like, well, there's a seal. What's up like a seal. I'm like, it's an Otter crap. I also have a two year old, the idea of naming animals is like what I do on a daily basis. So I have to like remind myself if the users, aren't all in that same scenario. [laughs] So these blue boxes take well to be like the next stop on the tour.

So this is kind of the same space, but from the other angle. So again, you can visit all the different spaces, like, our fabrication area, for example, like this is our wood shop. And you can meet Josh, who is the person who runs the wood shop. And so a little bit of a bio on Josh. That's a picture of his son. and you know, I try to make the descriptions fun, et cetera. And so overall, you could walk down the hallway and go to the conference room, you know, so it just a step by step through all of our spaces. And our space is so much of what we do, that we want him to be able to, share it. And we thought that having just like a walking video would be pretty darn boring. So, this was the solution that I revived on.

Mark Tippin: [00:17:40] That's wonderful. Well, I get the sense. It's almost like, you know, we do warm ups and we L we like people to, like, we just did like share a re you know, weird fact about yourself or something. And you've, you've kind of done that in an asynchronous mode for all of your staff. So now when people show up, you've built that familiarity, that kind of know what they look like. They [00:18:00] have something to talk about like, Oh, you, this windmill thing you were working on, you know.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:18:04] Yeah.

Mark Tippin: [00:18:04] So they have, they, they show up ready to kind of have conversations and, and ease some of that. getting back into school and space tension is now familiarity. That's wonderful.

Haley Temple: [00:18:17] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

Mark Tippin: [00:18:18] Yeah. So that's the goal. and just, you know, try to like personalize our people when they're emailing with them, et cetera.

Haley Temple: [00:18:25] Awesome. This is, and we have some of the people in the audience asking if it's possible to get a you-only link to this so they could... 'cause they, if that's okay, we can, we can share that later on.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:18:37] Yeah. Let me, and I think, I think I've everything locked down. I mean, that's the goal.

Haley Temple: [00:18:41] That's always like the facilitators, like last thing you do, right? It's like, did I lock it down?

Mark Tippin: [00:18:46] The other thing I'm assuming here is that, that this was kind of fast, right? People sometimes get like, you know, Haley and I talk about our perfectionist nature and how we'd like, Oh, it's kind of, we got to keep polishing, keep up, but this is something where you I'd imagine you built one of these blocks. You said, "Well, it's got to have a description. We're going to drop a photo in. We're going to use blue as an indicator of a link area." And so you kind of created this visual structure and they're able to copy and paste it and build this out pretty quickly. I would imagine it's, you know, you, didn't, you're able to get it up and ready and linked, you know, you know, pretty quickly and give it structure.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:19:24] yes. You know, I kind of laughed the way that you say that it was done quickly, just because pretty, I mean more or less prior to this project, I, I, all right hold on.

Mark Tippin: [00:19:37] I'm, I'm also thinking in terms of like dealing with the campus print shop and how do we print up brochures and how do we lay it out and do I have to go sign off on approve? You're kind of like, well, when I build it, if we all say it looks good, it's kind of like ship it. Yeah.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:19:52] yes. I mean, it was definitely, you know, definitely have the ability to, copy a lot of things. I'm getting the content in there. I think it was the time was [00:20:00] the time consuming thing. And so I actually had some help from one of my student employees. So they pulled a lot of information off of our website. and then I wrote all the ones about our people and actually had kind of fun with it. And then they started making fun of some of them, you know? I mean, I was like, if you don't provide me a photo, I will put embarrassing photos of you in there.

Mark Tippin: [00:20:19] That's right.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:20:19] Like Byron kissing his wife. And he was like, "Can I change that photo?" I'm like, "Absolutely." But send me something [crosstalk 00:21:41].

Mark Tippin: [00:20:25] [laughs]

Haley Temple: [00:20:26] But it's very human. Like the fact that you have some of these things on here. I imagine now when I meet Byron, it's gonna feel very, like, I know him already a little bit.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:20:36] Yeah. He's a real person.

Haley Temple: [00:20:39] Yeah. That's awesome. so if you are comfortable sharing the visitor link and, you can change the settings to view only,

Rebecca Komarek: [00:20:48] I believe I shared a visitor link in the chat.

Haley Temple: [00:20:50] Oh you did?

Rebecca Komarek: [00:20:51] It was very successful.

Mark Tippin: [00:20:51] Oh, perfect. Yeah. Wonderful. Thank you.

Haley Temple: [00:20:53] Thank you. All right. Well, this now, so it's awesome. Our community now has that available. Thank you for being open and sharing that. Now I know we also wanted to spend some time focusing on a new challenge that you are working on for this semester. So I'm gonna jump back into our regular or share my screen again and jump back into the MURAL. And Rebecca, talk me through what your challenges for this semester that maybe our panelists can help with. And as you're doing that, I'm going to promote some of our panelists or people from the audience to panelists.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:21:35] Sure. So, one of the things that we, you know, we, we really our, our niche on campus is the physical prototyping area. And, and so we want to be able to continue to provide a physical prototyping experience. We generally do this at workshops and these workshops are geared towards, there's a campus innovation and entrepreneurship initiative. So we really promote [00:22:00] this to campus entrepreneurs, as well as anybody who's really interested in prototyping. So beyond engineering, you know, anybody on campus who's interested and sometimes we typically get, community members as well. And so you can see the pictures of our prototyping workshop, where the thing that we prototype, in a workshop that we currently have is a seating experience. and so you can see of our students are workshop participants, showing off their seating experience. So say the one on the bottom is more of a stool type thing.

The one that you see being kind of in the middle, they dared me to sit on the chair that I designed. we call it the Stargazer 5000. So it's like a warming seat with a telescope on the side, and there's like a spot for wine right there, you can see. and so, you know, again, a seating experience. And so the idea is like that we build it a full size seat out of cardboard and duct tape and, and then talk about it. And so, I mean, now that so much is remote on campus. We are our working theories that students are sick of Zoom. They spend too much time on Zoom. And so we still want to be able to provide them some kind of a hands on experience. And so, I actually signed on to, guest lecture in a colleagues, class to do a prototyping workshop.

And so I'm like, okay, well, let's figure something out where we can still have students do something physically. so we have the ability for students to pop over to the airport can pick up a kit, you know, so we can provide them with some materials or we could, you know, think about materials that people have at home. But we'd like to be able to have them do something, you know, they're on MURAL, you know, say for this workshop, but if they're also spending time building something with their hands, that is actually physical. And so that's kind of a challenge that I see is how might we actually run a physical prototyping workshop using digital tools, such as such as MURAL.

Haley Temple: [00:24:00] [00:24:00] Okay. I love that. Thank you for the, how might we statement? All right. I'm gonna put this up here. And also in the meantime, welcome our panelists. So we have Jeroen, we have Rosalyn, Allie and Sanjay who are our panelists, our guests for today, who will be your consultants for this session.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:24:24] I'm so excited. Thank you all for your contributions.

Haley Temple: [00:24:27] All right. So I'm going to, once again, put the link to the, these, to this MURAL in the chat for our panelists, who will need to sign in to access. But why don't we take maybe five minutes or so for our panelists to ask any questions that you might have for Rebecca about this challenge. And Mark me, what I'll do is ask you for help capturing some of those questions and responses below. All right. So BC who from our panels group has a question about, about this challenge. All right. Jeroen. Go for it.

Jeroen Frumau: [00:25:19] I was just curious to hear a little bit more about what type of prototypes the students actually make. So what can we expect from them if they would be in the physical space? so what's the challenge to make it virtual, but what are the typical prototype examples?

Rebecca Komarek: [00:25:35] really, it varies a lot. We support a lot of, engineering capstone project. So the ones they do senior year, which are industry sponsored. And so, in, in those projects, they could be medical devices now that are 3D printed or made with metal in the machine shop are welded together. we, I mean, it's really, it's really quite varied. So maybe it's medical devices. I worked with a team that devised a payload for a rocket, and they [00:26:00] had cameras. They had four cameras that like extended out once that rocket was in space to video the actual flight, and then they would retract and go back in. and additionally we've made toys for kids in hospitals. We have made, we, the students, have made, vehicles like there, are typically we have a team who works on a Baja competition vehicle.

So they make the whole frame, you know, of the, of the off road vehicle and drive it. You know, so all of these things get made in our facility. And so the way that we generally approach the prototyping workshop is that we talk about, kind of the theory behind prototype and why do you prototype? And the idea that you can, can, can prototype anything, the prototype and experience you can prototype a product. And so what we're really encouraging people to do is to use these cheap, quick materials that it's like a very low level prototype that just screaming for iteration, you know. That would be, you know, if you're really designing a product, this would be, you know, the first of 20 cheap prototypes, like leading towards the thing that you would 3D print or the thing that you would machine. Does that help?

Mark Tippin: [00:27:13] Yeah, that helps I think.

Haley Temple: [00:27:16] Jamie also had a question, are they able to schedule about one hour in person for this? I mean, currently with things on campus so they can do their own physical prototyping? Or is all the prototyping having to be done off campus?

Rebecca Komarek: [00:27:30] we are planning to run our prototyping workshops 100% remotely. So we'll be there at the same time as students, but that, that actual workshop will be held remotely. and so right now we can't, right now, for the next two weeks anyway, campus has 100% remote courses. So we could not run up perfect. In theory, after this two weeks, we might be able to have some kind of in person thing, but, we are choosing not to, because we want to be able to plan something and know for sure [00:28:00] that we'll be able to run it like that consistency. We've learned, we've learned from the Spring that students respond much better. Like, you know, the thing that was most stressful about the Spring was the uncertainty and the back and forth. and so we just want to really encourage consistency. So students are able to come to our space and pick up something like we can leave it out, you can swipe in at our doors, they can pop in and like grab, you know, say a bag of supplies and take it home. and that's something we're willing to do, but they can't like stay and hang out and build, collaboratively in our spaces right now.

Haley Temple: [00:28:36] Got it. Thank you, Rosalyn or I'm apologize if mispronuncing you. I saw you typed it in the chat book, go ahead and unmute and ask aloud.

Rosalyn Allison-Jacobs: [00:28:47] Hi, I'm just curious to know whether, students typically work in teams on prototyping and generally in if they do in teams, folks typically bring different skill sets, hopefully complimentary. I'm wondering if there's a way to sort of inventory what people are particularly good at and then have them rotate through different roles. For example, is there a way for someone to sort of free hand draw sketches, people are ideating, as one particular skill and maybe rotate team members through that role. And maybe another team member can actually have materials present in their space, be on camera and sort of follow instructions of their team members as they try to, put materials together in different and creative ways.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:29:38] I mean, I think that that's, that's certainly possible. so generally when we do a workshop, we don't, or in the past, anyway, we haven't known the specific strengths of all of the people who are attending. maybe we've asked the question of like what their major is, you know, what they're studying. So we would know that we have X engineers, X business students, and X [00:30:00] arts and science students in the room. But then we, you know, again in this kind of informal workshop format, they usually also form their own teams. Historically, it doesn't mean we have to do that in a future, but meaning that, that engineering student comes with three engineering friends. They're probably going to be a team together. Right. Just so we haven't put that extra effort into like making sure, you know, for the short term activity, we haven't made extra effort to make sure that those diverse, people are working together in a team, but typically they do work in a team.

Haley Temple: [00:30:36] Thank you. Alright. one more question. And we can jump into maybe some of the going into ideation. So Allie or Sanjay do either of you have questions for Rebecca? No. Okay. I have one more question or if Sarah, one of you have one.

Jeroen Frumau: [00:31:10] Yeah. I was thinking, it's a prototyping shop at an educational Institute. So you can look to two ways. You want to develop prototypes to test ideas. But if you would define the prototype shop from an educational point, if you, what learning goals, what learning objectives do you want to give your students with the workshop?

Haley Temple: [00:31:23] I would say that through this workshop, we want to empower them to recognize they can prototype using quickly using cheap materials. we think, I mean, as we observed students, it seems like they're very resistant. but they... To, to doing this. They want to get something perfect before they show it to anybody where the design process to do it well, you're going to be doing a, like building things, getting feedback, changing it, building it again. And so we want to encourage that mindset and then encourage intentional prototyping. So prototyping with a specific question in mind, that hopefully a user or et cetera could, you know, would be able to comment on from [00:32:00] testing out that prototype or, you know, working with it.

Mark Tippin: [00:32:02] It sounds like part of that is also, kind of removing all of the negative aspects of critique, which I know from I was in design school. So that was something you really had to, you had to learn, it takes two types of skills, one as giving feedback, you have to give feedback that that is in the spirit of trying to make something better, not critiquing the person. [laughs] but then as being able to receive feedback that's critical in, in well in the 21st century. [laughs] You know, so, wonderful,

Haley Temple: [00:32:38] Awesome. Well, thank you for the, in the context and Rebecca and her filling this in and for our consultants for exploring with us, what I would love to do next is give you, you guys some time and opportunity to start brainstorming a potential solution. and maybe what we'll do is have each of you do an individual brainstorm and then we'll focus on one particular solution and then start prototyping that solution. So if we think about how might you run a physical prototyping workshop using digital tools is our, is our challenge. We have our context here. and maybe what I'll do is give you before we start another minute or so to scan and review. And while you're doing that, I'm going to set up some individual spaces for you guys to brainstorm. So I'll set a timer for about one minute and our consultants, please go ahead and just scan these responses, these photos. And in the meantime, the audience will see me up these individual working spaces. [00:34:00] Oh, apologies, rustling here we are. I'll ask you to follow me so you can see what I'm seeing. Does everyone feel like they have a good sense of the challenge? Now they're ready to do some brainstorming around a potential solution. Maybe I'll give one more minute.

Mark Tippin: [00:35:09] Do I get to participate.

Haley Temple: [00:35:12] Of course you do Mark.

Mark Tippin: [00:35:13] Okay. Awesome. I don't want to [crosstalk 00:37:08].

Haley Temple: [00:35:14] And Rebecca, you can as well, if maybe this is like highlighted some, some new ideas for you as well. And we have some requests for demoing our private mode, which I will definitely do. We're also not in the chat. Are you having issues accessing the MURAL?

Rebecca Komarek: [00:35:48] No. No, I'm good now. Thanks for [crosstalk 00:37:44].

Haley Temple: [00:35:50] Oh your good. Okay.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:35:51] Nice for you to follow thank you.

Haley Temple: [00:35:52] Okay, I wanted to make sure. Yeah, always, keeping me honest with good facilitator best practices is just making sure you can see what I'm seeing. It's always good. All [00:36:00] right. Oh my gosh. Here we go. We have Jeroen already off to the races, which is awesome. but what I'm going to do is ask you guys, the rest of us who don't have spaces yet here to claim one of these areas. You can double click to add your own name to a space. So I'll do mine here. So we're back in Rosalyn. If you already, if you don't have a space yet, go ahead and add it.

And, what I'm going to ask you guys to do first team is I know Jeroen and Mark, you're adding some images, which is wonderful. Always welcome.

Mark Tippin: [00:36:40] I'm sorry. We're getting ahead of you.

Haley Temple: [00:36:42] I know you can help it. It's still okay. I do want to show, we have a lot of requests to show private mode. So I would love to experiment with private mode before we jump in.

Mark Tippin: [00:36:51] Let's do it.

Haley Temple: [00:36:52] All right, Rebecca, do you, do you want to use this space here as well? Or do you want to [crosstalk 00:38:51].

Rebecca Komarek: [00:36:56] Oh, I was going to say. You, I kinda love hearing what everyone else is saying.

Haley Temple: [00:37:01] All right. That's totally fine. We can, we can hang out and watch and learn. So I'm going to use private mode and I'm going to ask everybody to do is in your working space spend, let's spend, let's start with one minute just to get some initial ideas out, brainstorming on sticky notes, some ideas for this solution. How or this question? How might we run a physical prototyping workshop using digital tools? And I'm going to paste it in your working space so you can reference it if you'd liked to do.

Jeroen Frumau: [00:37:38] [inaudible 00:39:36].

Haley Temple: [00:37:40] Sorry.

Jeroen Frumau: [00:37:41] Are you on private already?

Haley Temple: [00:37:43] Here we go. Now we're in private mode. So this little glasses then hat here, it says during private mode content created or edited by others will be hidden. So that way you don't have to worry about anyone snagging ideas, you [00:38:00] don't have to worry about group think. This is an awesome new feature. So I actually haven't used it yet, but now I can see, Ooh, it's like very, very,  

Jeroen Frumau: [00:38:13] I can't see anything else.

Haley Temple: [00:38:13] I think if you can see op... see stuff that was added before private mode, but you can't see stuff once it's I should lock this down. once it's, there, like once I've started private mode, anything now that's added. I won't be able to see.

Jeroen Frumau: [00:38:33] Cool.

Haley Temple: [00:38:37] All right. So I'm going to do another minute. I'm going to keep private mode on and I'm trying to think of a fun Mark. Give us a brainstorming prompt.

Mark Tippin: [00:38:45] brainstorming prompt. Well, I will, I'm like deep in the question [crosstalk 00:40:49].

Haley Temple: [00:38:48] Oh you are deep in the... okay I'm going to do a brainstorming prompt. Okay. How would, how would it Elon Musk solve this challenge?

Mark Tippin: [00:38:59] Oh, I see. Alternative world. All right, let's go.

Haley Temple: [00:39:01] Yeah, yeah.

Mark Tippin: [00:39:02] Got it. Got it.

Haley Temple: [00:39:03] I'm going to give us two minutes to brainstorm on sticky notes again. And maybe we'll do in the meantime too, while you're thinking and channeling your inner Elon Musk to solve this challenge, I can play some music. I like to imagine Elon would play something like this.

Mark Tippin: [00:39:47] [laughs] I'm sure he would. I'm sure this is playing in his Tesla, the Turtling for space right now,

Haley Temple: [00:39:55] [inaudible 00:41:56]. He probably only does play [00:40:00] Grimes. All right, so, thank you guys for experiments with private mode with me. I'm going to remove it in a moment. and by the way, I, I'm learning. So this sticky note was added before private mode started, which somebody could still see it, but anything that was added after I started private mode is, invisible. So here we go. I'm going to end private mode and reveal content. All right. So maybe let's go through each person's, space and you can share out your ideas with us as we go through. so maybe let me see Rosalyn, if we're going to start on your space and I'm going to ask everyone to follow me to Rosalyn [00:42:00] space and Rosalyn share what were some of your ideas?

Rosalyn Allison-Jacobs: [00:42:04] So I'm actually in the midst of trying to plan something similar around, a design thinking sprint that we're going to have to do virtually. And I, I, my, my preference is always for team modes, so I'm going to say that upfront to have folks work in teams, even if they are on very fluid teams that sort of reconfigure consistently throughout a process. so I'm trying to think of, I, I actually would like to experiment, I would suggest experimenting with having one or more students, have the prototyping materials physically present and on camera for the rest of the team or the rest, the rest of the workshop participants. and actually manipulate and create the prototypes in real time. I've got some variations on that in which maybe smaller teams are providing instructions to the student that has the materials about how to construct them, to create prototypes. So it's, it's sort of that challenge of, of building the elephant.

Let's see what else I've got here. I think that's probably my favorite one. also brainstorming as a whole workshop, what the parameters need to be around the prototype beforehand, then letting folks work independently, and sharing on camera what they've, what they've built, receiving feedback about opportunities for improvement. so maybe some collective thinking about that.

Haley Temple: [00:43:35] Thanks.

Rosalyn Allison-Jacobs: [00:43:36] I haven't thought about, well, this is my last one is maybe placing some, some virtual materials on MURAL, MURAL and asking participants to think in 3D about how they might use them and create prototypes.

Haley Temple: [00:43:52] Awesome. Thank you. All right, let's go over to Jeroen next. [00:44:00] I give you one minute. Ready?

Jeroen Frumau: [00:44:01] I was first thinking very linear of using let's say virtual sketching tools. Three-day Kat, then go to 3D. Shouldn't be three amps would be 3D. That's in their professional deficiency, professionalization the TV, remote printing, and then maybe using VR or augmented, reality glasses for the students to actually observe what operators are doing in the lab, so that there'll be, can be as close as possible, still being remotely. But when you challenge me on a Elon Musk, I think he has a factory full of, robots. So why not put the robots in the prototype lab and have them prototype for the students or deliver the prototype via self-drive Teslas. maybe distributed virtual duct-tape as a utility, through MURAL. And the last one is maybe having rolling prototype collapse with 3D printers and materials that actually are delivered at your doorstep. When you need the prototype as a student team.

Haley Temple: [00:44:57] Hmm. That's really, I mean, it kinda reminds me of the Amazon prototype where you have like different spaces on campus, where you could pick up prototyping materials rather than just like that central spot. It's really cool. All right. let me see, I'll come back, Jamie. I know you're not a panelist at the moment, but I will give you, I'll give you panelists opportunity so you can share. All right, Mark. Tell us what some of your top ones were.

Mark Tippin: [00:45:21] yeah, sure. So actually I did less of a brainstorm and I got right into the process. I was, I was listening to some of the questions up front and I thought, okay, so we, we have to deal with this blended reality of some stuff's physical and virtual. And then maybe is there a way to do, to bring some of that together at some point? So this is more looking, that row is more looking at the sequence 'cause I, I kind of, we designed workshops all the time, so I'm trying to think about. So there's an online part where you could actually get the team to meet each other and get the brief, get oriented, wherever they are, even perhaps before they're physically in Colorado. And then, then there's this moment that needs to [00:46:00] be coordinated about visit, physically being in the shop space, getting up, you're picking up your supplies and that's like an experience in a moment that needs some attention for them.

Then they would be working online and get them to work with some type of constraints, like three or four, like ugly first drafts. So they're, they're either like you get four pieces of paper and like the marshmallow challenge, right. But there's a sequence of like, what can we do to reinforce iteration that they do virtually and then the physical activity and then maybe parallel play was, was something I was getting at. And I was exploring other tools that might help, give them access to virtual worlds for building stuff. And there's like stood Stud.io and, mental canvas are, are some that might be interesting.

Haley Temple: [00:46:46] That's really freaking cool. All right. Thank you.

Mark Tippin: [00:46:49] Yeah, sure.

Haley Temple: [00:46:49] All right. And Jamie, I know I just promoted you to panelist. Welcome. Are you able to come off audio? There you go. Hi Jamie.

Jamie Gardner: [00:46:59] Hi. Hi y'all. so no, that was really fun and inspiring to see all these different ideas. Mine are actually, it's very a simplified version of each of them. I think so really establishing what the challenge is and the timeline or what the processes they're going to each go through. So it's all the same students pick, each pick up their bag of supplies. They have time individually to come up with an approach or a cab design or whatever it may be. And then when the first time they meet, it's more like a pitch competition or the process being which they pitched their ideas in order to get fast feedback from everyone in the classroom.

And then they have individual times to iterate on that feedback. And then they get to go into peer to peer collaboration so that they can start building on one and either ideas. And it's more of a cyclical process, right. That they iterate over and over again. But that way they're having both individual time as well as collaboration time. So each are following the same process. What I don't know, and I think would be curious, is, are they all working on the same problem or are they working on different stages of a problem?i think I might need more information in order to better design [00:48:00] that.

Haley Temple: [00:48:01] Rebecca, I'll leave that for you to answer. Are they all work in the same or in different challenges.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:48:06] I think for the purpose of this, it would all be the same challenge just because we're talking about like a onetime standalone workshop.

Jamie Gardner: [00:48:14] Yeah. And I loved the, you know, Jeroen's edition of the think big. Right. What if you were to be like, if you were Elon mask, how might you approach this? And all of a sudden opened up a completely different approach. Great work.

Haley Temple: [00:48:25] Nice. Awesome. so I want to be, I want to, we have about seven minutes left here, crew Rebecca. I want to be mindful of your, you've heard a couple of your solutions. Are there any, in particular that stand out to you that we could invite this team, these consultants to start prototyping in MURAL for you?

Rebecca Komarek: [00:48:45] well I just wanted to make one little comment about this, that I started this one, the rolling prototype labs. from Jeroen because, we have a guy that we work with who specializes building, hands on experiences or like 3D printing for kids in hospital. And he wants to, he's like applying for a grant to get a van that he could like put a bunch of 3D printers on it that he could then drive to like the children's hospital of Colorado, park outside and there's like a mobile making station. So I am just saying like that, was, was super interesting. I'm not sure how, I mean, I don't, you know, I think that that's pretty awesome. And if you can like, think about what that bring, could bring to this, to this idea. I mean, something from Rosalyn that stood out to me was just the idea of forming teams.

You know, we can form teams based on like your, this major, that major, but then also like switching teams up and like assigning roles, you know, like the idea of like he had mentioned at the beginning of the questions about like students' strengths and stuff. So that's kind of an interesting thing to really, really a way to like an interesting way to find teams and how to switch up teams, throughout the process, which I think could be interesting. I appreciate from Mark, just the idea of like the workshop, like flow of process for it. I really appreciate that. 'Cause it's like, that's something that we have to think about, like [00:50:00] how do we actually do this? You know, if one of our goals is encouraging students to iterate, like we probably need to build that in to the workshop. [laughs] You know, which your currently using? you know, with the idea that like make those ugly first drafts, like let's do that and normalize it or try to normalize it again. And for short period of time.

Mark Tippin: [00:50:17] Right.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:50:18] normalize that to like, to try to get them to something that's, you know, the next phase and like, be like, yeah, let's like have a contest. You can have the ugliest, or maybe they don't know that, but like it was giving me an award at the end or whatever the case is [crosstalk 00:53:01].

Haley Temple: [00:50:30] And I wonder if time boxing the students too. Sorry, I was thinking like giving in the first time they meet, like you facilitate and you time box them. 'Cause you saw with, when I escaped you guys, let 30 seconds to draw your fun fact. You can't make something perfect in 30 seconds.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:50:45] I think [crosstalk 00:53:18].

Haley Temple: [00:50:48] I do too. But other they tell the story without being perfect. And that's the point of a prototype? Sorry. Continue I was excited by that one. Oh, go ahead, Mark.

Mark Tippin: [00:50:58] I was just going to say I was, I was running a workshop for Luma once and we were doing prototypes, physical prototypes of paper, whatever they. And one poor attendee, her team abandoned her. They're like, "Oh, we have other meetings. We have to leave early." And so when it came time, I said, "Okay, we're going to do think aloud testing, get feedback." And she's, "I'm sorry. All I have are these six posted notes on the wall. My team left me." I'm like, "Good enough. Let's do it." And even with six posted notes, when it was all done, I said, "Well, did you get useful feedback?" Absolutely. Did it, did, were they able to highlight some issues and challenges and give you some new ideas? Absolutely. So I'm like there is no minimum or, you know, there is no threshold below with a prototype, cannot add value to a discussion.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:51:40] Mm-hmm [affirmative].  

Haley Temple: [00:51:42] Rebecca, was there anything else you wanted to highlight? I'm sorry, I keep cutting you off. Oh, go ahead.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:51:47] No, no, I don't think so. I mean, I'm just really, I'm really grateful for all of the kind of ideas and things to think about already from what we've talked about.

Haley Temple: [00:51:56] Wonderful. Well, I'm glad, I'm glad this is helpful and [00:52:00] consultants, first of all, thank you guys so much for jumping in and helping think, helping of thinking about physical prototyping in a remote space, especially as students definitely need to have these kinds of experiences as part of their, of their time at school. Rebecca, thank you for showing your immersive prototyping, your immersive story and tour of your space too. That was really, really cool to see. And I think it inspires a lot of us to think about different spaces that we need to bring online when we can't be in person. And the last thing I'll do is ask our audience. If you guys have any questions, we can answer them in the last two minutes. and also we can ask for, I'd love to ask for feedback.

That's a huge gift for us at Backstage Pass. We want to have topics that are relevant for you and make sessions that are engaging. So, on a scale of one to 10, how satisfied or how, yeah, how satisfied are you with today's sessions? One being, it was a waste of time, not valuable, 10 being super valuable and why. and as you are sharing your ratings and suggestions, we can actually, Rebecca, I'm gonna ask you to share how did you do those linking coming back to that? The linking, sticky notes? No, I almost forgot and Ediya yet Eddie to, Oh my gosh. I cannot pronounce names, apologies, asked us to share that again.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:53:22] Yeah. so I'm, I'm Haley, I'm on your little [crosstalk 00:56:04].

Haley Temple: [00:53:25] Okay. I'll here. I'll follow you.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:53:28] Okay. so if you can, you can see what I'm doing, right? I right click.

Haley Temple: [00:53:32] Oh, maybe not. Maybe I need to show, if you can hear all you explain and I will show and we can like tag team.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:53:39] Okay. Well, so if, if Haley were to right click on her little gray box there.

Haley Temple: [00:53:45] Oh yeah, my box, yeah.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:53:48] You can link to this area. So click that and then it gives you a little URL looking thing, so you can copy and paste it. And then let's go over to this yellow box.

Haley Temple: [00:54:01] [00:54:00] Design.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:54:01] Yeah. So then they're, so in that little format thing, you can enter the link, hit enter, and then there's a little button that shows up [crosstalk 00:56:51].

Haley Temple: [00:54:11] [inaudible 00:56:51].

Rebecca Komarek: [00:54:11] Yeah, that'd be better. and so when you click that button, it will take you directly to, and kind of centered on that area, that you link to. So you can link to, a sticky note. You can link to, to anything, right?

Haley Temple: [00:54:29] Yeah. I've linked to shapes. I think I've linked to shapes. I don't know. I don't can you, Oh yeah. You can link on images too.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:54:37] Yeah. So, and I've done it. So initially I started by linking to images and then I whole, figured out the whole area thing and I was like, well, that's better. And it's only for the whole area because it took it to kind of a more centered area, like a more centered place.

Haley Temple: [00:54:49] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

Rebecca Komarek: [00:54:50] And then I'd say one other super useful thing that I found is that when I first had the link, like I shared, you know, my whole MURAL, I shared with one of my student employees. When they linked into my broader tour MURAL, they like saw everything. So he didn't know where to start. You know, they just saw all these little boxes and they were like, well, crap. so, yeah, instead I had to take the, the area that I wanted to be the first stop on my tour.

Haley Temple: [00:55:16] Mm-hmm [affirmative].

Rebecca Komarek: [00:55:17] I had to add it to the outline. And then there's the three dot button on the outline, which you can right click on and you can link to this stuff. So I linked to this step directly, which then like brings when, you know what, so that's, what's on our website that people click on to get to the tour. So they linked to the step that I want them to link to. So that was actually like pretty important for what I want to do because we needed them to start like anybody like random, who, who pops in to take the tour, they need to start in the right place or they'll, it doesn't make any sense.

Haley Temple: [00:55:49] Right.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:55:50] Actually. I emailed Jeff from MURAL and he told me that trick. And then that's, I think actually it was full conversations.

Haley Temple: [00:55:57] Yeah, [00:56:00] that was smart [crosstalk 00:58:42].

Rebecca Komarek: [00:56:00] That was the, that was the kicker. I had been at the workshop where Jeff was one of the people.

Haley Temple: [00:56:04] Okay, nice. Yeah. So just to like, make sure I understand it's you use the outline, which you, the outline uses areas to help to your point. It's a way finding method in MURAL. And so you took this link to this step from it and pasted it on the same thing. Like the texts. I know we're a little overtime [inaudible 00:59:08].

Rebecca Komarek: [00:56:25] Yeah, well I actually pasted it. That's the link that I used on the idea of forge websites [crosstalk 00:59:13]. So like on our typical website.

Haley Temple: [00:56:32] Oh smart.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:56:32] So that when the students click the, take the tour button. They go directly into MURAL and they go directly to that area. That was the, like the starting point, kind of like the navigation, the first, you know with instructions [crosstalk 00:59:28].

Haley Temple: [00:56:45] Smart so they are not dropped into like a big MURAL. It's just like you are [crosstalk 00:59:32].

Rebecca Komarek: [00:56:48] Well they don't know. Yeah. They have no clue where to begin. It takes them directly focusing on the spot that will start them on all of the steps of the tour.

Haley Temple: [00:56:57] That's a great hack. Well, thank you. Thank you so much for sharing. continuing to share that knowledge with us and to our panelists again, thank you guys for joining us today. I'll have you guys, you can sign off for the day, but or from here you could probably [crosstalk 00:59:55].

Rebecca Komarek: [00:57:11] Well, thank you very much.

Haley Temple: [00:57:14] [laughs] Have...

Mark Tippin: [00:57:14] It was wonderful meeting you, Rebecca. I just, want to thank you. Yeah.

Haley Temple: [00:57:18] Yeah.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:57:18] You as well.

Haley Temple: [00:57:18] Have a wonderful rest of your day guys.

Rebecca Komarek: [00:57:19] Yeah, this was fun.

Mark Tippin: [00:57:19] All right.

Haley Temple: [00:57:22] Yeah. It was. Take care

Mark Tippin: [00:57:24] Take care everyone.

Haley Temple: [00:57:25] Bye.

Mark Tippin: [00:57:25] Bye-bye.